Author Topic: please help me ID these GNB batteries  (Read 7749 times)

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mike_belben

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please help me ID these GNB batteries
« on: August 31, 2012, 05:26:43 PM »
a bank of GNB absolyte II (NOT IIP) having a tag that says "type 6-75A11" and individual cells all with a serial number "KKP29E"



the cells have not been used in atleast 6 years, from a telecom backup.  its possible that they have very little use, but they were definitely hooked up at one time since the two wire connections show tool marks.  either way,  theres no one around to get a history that far back.  all i know is they show around half a volt per cell give or take, the entire array in series was about 14 volts.  none look bulged, and all were stored in year round climate control within the metal case, on their sides.   i dont have access to anything more than run of the mill 12v automotive chargers.  can i use this to put a charge to them in a 12v string for testing purposes?

id like to know the specs, and how i can reasonably determine if this bank is salvageable or not.  i know nothing about RE except that its something id like to eventually dedicate some time to, and that if this bank can work, its a huge springboard ahead for my collection.

please point me in the right direction, and thanks in advance.

mike

bob g

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Re: please help me ID these GNB batteries
« Reply #1 on: August 31, 2012, 09:06:28 PM »
more than likely they are agm type batteries, so they might be recoverable

you will need a charger that can startup charging a dead battery to start with

set it to low amperage and let it do its thing, it might take several days to get back up to something useful

if you cannot get them to accept a charge, you might carefully remove the caps and add a few cc's of distilled water heated up to about 120 degree's F,,,

once you get them charged up, put a load on them and drain them flat as a pancake, then short the posts and leave them overnight

then repeat the process, each cycle the capacity ought to increase.

once you get them to something useable, use them down to about 50% SOC and over time they will improve a bit more.

another trick is to turn the cells upside down to charge them, this will get the water to wick back up into the glass matt sometimes.

be prepared to spend several days before you see any progress, and don't add any edta or other miracle elixer, and don't use a desulfator either.... simply keep them on a charger and wait for it to get them working again.

if you add water make sure you measure it and keep it equal in all cells, start with maybe 10 cc per cell and use a syringe to distribute it as best you can across the plates in each cell.  the ideas is to just get a little moistening of the mats so that charging can start to take place. after they begin to charge the interior of each cell will start to get water/acid vapor working up through the mats and over time get things working again.

all this assumes the batteries had some life left in then back when they were parked, if they were at the end of their life, it is doubtful that you will get anything out of them.

bob g
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large frame automotive alternators for high output/high efficiency project X alternator for 24, 48 and higher voltages, and related cogen components.
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mike_belben

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Re: please help me ID these GNB batteries
« Reply #2 on: September 01, 2012, 06:27:23 AM »
...
you will need a charger that can startup charging a dead battery to start with
....


thanks for all the information bob.  forgive my ignorance, but ive never heard of a battery charger that cant charge a dead battery, so im lost there.  still wondering if i can use an automotive 12v charger and do them in strings of 12v.

i suspect they have only been cycled a dozen times in their lives, despite the age.  they did backup duty at a place with very stable power, and have been disconnected/stored for years.

Frank S

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Re: please help me ID these GNB batteries
« Reply #3 on: September 01, 2012, 07:21:50 AM »
...
you will need a charger that can startup charging a dead battery to start with
....


thanks for all the information bob.  forgive my ignorance, but ive never heard of a battery charger that cant charge a dead battery, so im lost there.  still wondering if i can use an automotive 12v charger and do them in strings of 12v.

i suspect they have only been cycled a dozen times in their lives, despite the age.  they did backup duty at a place with very stable power, and have been disconnected/stored for years.
Most of the newer smart chargers will not even begin charging if the battery voltage is too low.
 we used to connect a battery that was about 2/3s discharged parallel to a completely dead battery and let them sit for a day with only a 5 amp trickle charger. if the dead battery had any voltage in it after a day then we tried to charge it by itself You had to be careful though because the discharged battery could still have enough juice in it to damage the dead battery. That was also how my dad lost the sight in one of his eyes even though he had on glasses
I live so far outside of the box, when I die they will stretch my carcass over the coffin

mike_belben

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Re: please help me ID these GNB batteries
« Reply #4 on: September 01, 2012, 08:24:22 AM »
well all i own is stupid chargers, so i guess i shouldnt have that problem.   :)

thanks for the explanations.

DamonHD

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Re: please help me ID these GNB batteries
« Reply #5 on: September 01, 2012, 01:28:40 PM »
Hey, all my chargers have a stupid owner.  %-P

Rgds

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SparWeb

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Re: please help me ID these GNB batteries
« Reply #6 on: September 02, 2012, 09:08:54 PM »
Same thing happened to me several years ago:  discovered a set of GNB batteries, discarded, so I hauled the massive things home and began the long-slow process of figuring out if they were okay.  Turns out they were pretty good, especially for my modest purposes.
The individual cells (if I'm thinking of the right configuration) is "2" volts per cell, but when at float charge they should be about 2.3 volts or so.  I think the bank you're describing would have a total 48v if it was restored and wired in series.  Or 24V if split into two parallel sets.  Or 12v in 4 parallel sets...   
You have a 12V charger, so make sure you are
a) connecting *6* cells together in series before charging up, if the cells are 2 volts per cell, OR
b) connecting *3* cells together in series before charging up, if the cells are 4 volts per cell, OR
c) connecting *2* cells together in series before charging up, if the cells are 6 volts per cell.....

Just not absolutely certain what is the volts per cell of your particular battery set.
You'll need to find a datasheet before going ahead safely.

I think I know where to find one - I'll be back later with a link if I can.
No one believes the theory except the one who developed it. Everyone believes the experiment except the one who ran it.
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SparWeb

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Re: please help me ID these GNB batteries
« Reply #7 on: September 02, 2012, 09:24:34 PM »
Hmmm... these could be discontinued...

http://industrialenergy.exide.com/ca/en/product-solutions/network-power/technologies-network/agm-network.aspx

You could poke around here for the owner's manual...

http://industrialenergy.exide.com/ca/en/product-solutions/network-power/downloads-network.aspx

...but all I'm turning up are the "50A" "90A" and "100A" series documents.
Maybe the 75A series are from the Absolyte "II" not "IIP"?

Still looking-
No one believes the theory except the one who developed it. Everyone believes the experiment except the one who ran it.
System spec: 135w BP multicrystalline panels, Xantrex C40, DIY 10ft (3m) diameter wind turbine, Tri-Star TS60, 800AH x 24V AGM Battery, Xantrex SW4024
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dapdan

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Re: please help me ID these GNB batteries
« Reply #8 on: September 02, 2012, 11:30:40 PM »
Mike,

Let me see if I can help you out here. The code KKP29E indicates that they were manufactured at the Kankakee plant October 29, 1989. The other marking indicate that it is a 6V battery module with each plate rated at 75Ah(8hr rate) per positive plate and each individual cell has 11 total plates with 5 positive plate so that the capacity of the  battery at 8hr discharge rate is 375Ah(5x75Ah).

Those batteries were the first model run of the absolyte series that were basically invented around 1985. The main physical difference between those and the IIP model was that they introduce a metal separator around the center cell because they had found that batteries were failing prematurely due to lack of compression. Each cell had to be compressed around all four side so that their could be intimate contact between the lead plates and the electrolyte soaked glass mat.

Cheers...
Damani

mike_belben

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Re: please help me ID these GNB batteries
« Reply #9 on: January 05, 2013, 07:24:05 AM »
the batteries were beyond salvation, and went in the dumpster :(

coldspot

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Re: please help me ID these GNB batteries
« Reply #10 on: January 05, 2013, 10:17:14 AM »
Please-
   "Recycle"
$0.02

DamonHD

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Re: please help me ID these GNB batteries
« Reply #11 on: January 05, 2013, 11:32:36 AM »
Indeed.

The content of an old battery is valuable, and can pollute ground-water and so on if just dumped in land-fill.

Rgds

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gww

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Re: please help me ID these GNB batteries
« Reply #12 on: January 10, 2013, 04:14:28 PM »
I wish I was your dumpster.  I am going to have to pay core charges on 16 batteries.
cheers
gww

mike_belben

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Re: please help me ID these GNB batteries
« Reply #13 on: January 27, 2013, 06:57:02 AM »
scrap dumpster,  not a trash dumpster.  they werent gonna free to me either way, and i wasnt paying .15cents lb for 1800lbs of boat anchor.   peter demar saw photos of the negative terminals pushing the cases out and said they were gone, scrap em.