axial generator with lamination core

[bigrockcandymountain]

The guy wires look to me like a quick fix for an engineering fail.  I could be wrong, but that's the way it looks to me. 

[mbouwer]

All sorts of designs are made up to be able to make the blades longer.
Like here bushings in the blade root.

[mbouwer]

In Windpower Monthly Eize de Vries writes about a new segmented Enercon generator.
Reminds me of Kitestrings who also applied segments for his axial generator.

[MattM]

Iron sections?

[mbouwer]

So far I have not seen precise details of the technique used.

[topspeed]

Guying makes it possible to shape the blades longer and longer I think and to build turbines with more megawatts.

(Attachment Link)

Is this new or old set up ?

[mbouwer]

It was recently that reports about this guyed rotor appeared in several wind magazines.

[mbouwer]

With guying cables you get a much lighter blade I think.
And reinforced where the guy wire engages.

[mbouwer]

The other extreme: bending Adani blades.

[mbouwer]

Adani and Vestas do not have a direct drive.
I would also like to make a setup with a small axial with a transmission between the main shaft and the generator.

[brandnewb]

MBrouwer, while your are working on something awesome.

So am I

I think perhaps we might share some personal details.

I think I need your machining skills and I think you can make use of my coil winding skills.

[mbouwer]

Let's look at the possibilities
What direction do you want to take with wind energy?

[brandnewb]

Yes thank you.

I changed my mind regarding the PM. I am currently constructing a public post about my status and problem. Please join me there when you get around to it.

[brandnewb]

Please if you could have a stab at
https://www.fieldlines.com/index.php?topic=150806

[mbouwer]

You want: - a slow-turning mill
                - no problem with the authorities
                - you don't need a high yield.

An option is that I make you a model of an old Dutch mill with blades of approximately 1 meter. Then you can build a generator in there.

[brandnewb]

wow, its a lovly model of our mills.

But I respectfully decline your offer I am looking for something else.

[mbouwer]

A "Tjasker" I would also like to make. It would fit beautiful there on your waterfront and you can hang a small generator on it.

[mbouwer]

Shaping the blades in polyester " Tjaskerlike "
And active blade adjustment for an adjustable rounds per minute.

[brandnewb]

it's an idea indeed to use cloth. I am not sure though if they can make noise. But then again what I had planned might be noisy as well as I was planning to replace my current cup blades with much larger versions that can hinge in the middle as to allow for much less resistance when going against the wind and having springs pull them open again when the wind comes from behind.

Also making use of rigid insulation material rather than that heavy stuff I use now.

[MattM]

If you go with fabric it deteriorates and has to be replaced too often.  May as well build something durable.

Tjasker is pretty simple enough if you want to pump water.  But the deal with them is they can pivot 360 degrees.  They are offset between the center of gravity of the rotor and pivot, so that the rotor drag makes it pivot and self align to the wind.  Some of them are locked in place so that they do not run over their pump hoses.  But mostly they seem to have some degree of range.  With electrical generation this should not be a problem.

What is pretty interesting about this style is that drag is good.  It will never be HAWT fast while rotating, which is fine.  But your blades work as a long pivot arm works, which is in your favor for torque generation.

[brandnewb]

You want: - a slow-turning mill
                - no problem with the authorities
                - you don't need a high yield.

An option is that I make you a model of an old Dutch mill with blades of approximately 1 meter. Then you can build a generator in there.

(Attachment Link)

hahaha i realize now that you suggested to put my generator in that tiny mill model Well the generator is going to be 1.32meter diameter. That will never fit. Nah don't worry in the meantime I found a way to connect the rotor the the column.

[mbouwer]

A Tjasker would fit well in such a beautiful location.
I would make a real nice blade profile Ttjasker-like in colored polyester.

[brandnewb]

I think you mean well so I will ask my neighborhood. :

But honestly, More than 2 years I have been comming back to a VAWT. Of size

[mbouwer]

Do yourself, your family and the neighborhood a favor with a low blade-speed, no noise, a small generator and a nice workpiece that you always can control.

[mbouwer]

Striking on the forum is that we are struggling so much shaping the generator.

[MattM]

Striking on the forum is that we are struggling so much shaping the generator.
(Attachment Link)

That's probably because the generator is the real work. Pictures make it look so easy.  It is not.

[brandnewb]

I second that!

If we can keep things civil then I will admit that building an alternator is far more difficult than I had anticipated. Especially when the size increases.
And I am not even done with it yet.

All I can give is my mental support ;( Hang on my fellow Dutch builder.

I am so sorry that I am far behind your skills so I am probably of no use for the things your design is focussed at

I am trying a more "accessible to the newcomer" approach but even that is is turning out to require determination

I am sure you will get there. I have looked at what you work on from time to time and I recognise skill when I see it!

[mbouwer]

Wind energy fascinates me and I would like to discuss and apply (new) options for self-building.

[mbouwer]

What we also can discuss is that with cores in the coils, much less strong (and therefore much less expensive  ) magnets are needed for the same generator result.

[brandnewb]

(Attachment Link)

A Tjasker would fit well in such a beautiful location.
I would make a real nice blade profile Ttjasker-like in colored polyester.

Ok my brother. Let's have a talk about it.

So for you , which I would agree with, is the esthetics? I mean having a model of our heritage spinning around on my lawn would indeed be something totally cool.

But then what would I do if something breaks. Do I call you  and you come fix it? of course not. No I need to be able to understand all aspects of my own turbine so that I can see it break and then harden it on it's weak points.

Over 4 years of service I hope to have a turbine that is indestructible.

Of course I realize the non realisatie nature of my wishes. But over time I can see it spin, see it show signs of stress and then plan on how to make it stronger.

[mbouwer]

It is all about your area of ​​knowledge and possibilities to make a windmill.
Maybe start with a small axial generator?
Driving that generator at an accelerated rate with a chain drive.

[brandnewb]

ok well then here we have got a conundrum

As I know nothing about anything

Anyway I do not which to start hijacking your thread with things that are not really related to your mission other than that you and I are seemingly in the same boat.

I will try and refrain from posting here stuff that really is only geared towards my particular situation so hopefully the next paragraph will be the last one at that;

I am still strong headed, others call it foolhardy, to first try a direct drive rather than a geared one. I think I can keep things under control at 1.32m diam. And if indeed I can then I just removed another several points of failure.

But ok ok. Let see how far I get. You are not the first to suggest me to go for a geared drive and that might mean that is because you all know so much more than I do . lets give me a few moments to experiment ok?

[mbouwer]

neodymium magnets are basically 1 million amp turns per meter, and when the magnet is in open air, the magnetic field strength inside the magnet is about 1 to 1.1 T depending on the grade. (n42 to n52)

steel has a resistance of about 1/1000 to 1/10000th that of air. but the magnet itself is an air gap, which is why the flux density only increases 50% when the magnet is shorted out.

alnico magnets have a permeability of about 10, which is why they can be easily demagnetized. they can have a flux density change by like 5:1 when shorted out with steel iirc. (.2T in open air, 1T inside a core)

so the whole point of an iron core, is to make the magnet field value far higher with less volume of magnet that would otherwise be required.

Also what Joestue writes here must inspire us to use an iron core in the coils.