Author Topic: need help (Read 3501 times)

pepa · « **on:** July 05, 2007, 09:42:44 PM »

Do to illness; I have not been able to finish several projects that i told Bruce that i would finish . That said I have been doing a little cleaning in the shop and trying to pile the like parts together and came across some interesting items that might make a project some day. This stator is from a Coleman 1850 gas generator that took a saltwater bath and the rotor is from a 5hp air compressor motor. Placing ¾ x ¾ round cylinder magnets around the rotor leaves me 1/8 "gap between rotor and stator teeth with no milling needed. I know I will have to make a cage for the magnets but it should work.

The stator is wound with two sizes of wire in 24 slots and I was wondering if it could be used as a conversion without rewiring the coils or even if these parts could be used together as a generator. The motor ends will work and the shaft is long enough to make everything fit. Also the rotor is the same length as the stator teeth. I have put a piece of #14 wires in the photo for comparison of wire sizes and the existing wire looks like it might be a bit smaller but not much. Any thoughts or help would be welcome, pole count and any more information that you think is needed... Thanks pepa.

vawtman · « **Reply #1 on:** July 05, 2007, 05:16:09 PM »

Hi Pepa

Glad your feeling better.

I think your in to deep with this.Let her go in my opinion.Sorry.

Ive had to let many things go and probably not done yet.Learn a little each time though.

Maybe others will disagree.

Hang in there.

Mark

Warrior · « **Reply #2 on:** July 05, 2007, 05:22:11 PM »

Pepa,

That's a 2 pole alternator.It spins at 3500 rpm, meaning you'll need tons of magnet material or very high speed to get anything from it.

Try looking for a 1 HP 3 phase motor to make a decent conversion.

Good Luck,

Warrior

pepa · « **Reply #3 on:** July 05, 2007, 07:31:40 PM »

thanks Mark and Warrior, i know less about electric motors than i do about vawts, just playing with my junk. pepa

stephent · « **Reply #4 on:** July 05, 2007, 08:16:34 PM »

Well, pepa, the greenish corrosion would make me kinda nervous about the windings.

Using an ohm meter won't really tell if they want to blow through at 10 volts or higher.

It would be "usable"--but way lower watts out then rated at when used in charging a 12 volt battery bank.

Winding resistance will get ya. (1850 watts/220volts=? amps when maxed stock and that times 12 or 13 volts ain't much for watts)

Using the 2 main windings in series (and the "start" winding rectified separately) should be 200 rpm or a bit less cut-in rpm, (ballpark guess--but it could be like mine and need the main windings paralleled)

But YES single phase 2 pole gennys will work.

My conversion (single phase 2 pole) is close to your alternator specs and it works at 170 rpm approx cut-in very nicely (7 foot prop--it needs 7 1/2 foot though) when I use the main windings paralleled/rectified and start rectified separately. Cut-in is too low rpm to series the 2 main windings--my blades stall.

http://www.anotherpower.com/gallery/stephent/testing_precedure

But a 3phase motor would work as a better return on work/bucks vs the single phase.

But if the windings are good--and ya have it---??-- your choice.

/me inserts disclaimer here.....

Note--all cut-in rpm's are just math inspired "maybe's/probably's"..

Outside of that, I do know where my own genny cut's in at anyway.

...YMMV

ghurd · « **Reply #5 on:** July 06, 2007, 07:31:04 AM »

If you have `junk' magnets to go with the rest of the `junk'... why not?

Sounds like it wouldn't take you long to try.

To me it looks like it has a good number of turns.

It will take a lot of magnets to get it doing a lot, but I don't think the speed would be unreasonable for a small HAWT.

But I'm not very picky on what I end up with at the end. If it charges a 12V battery, I'm happy.

G-

pepa · « **Reply #6 on:** July 06, 2007, 08:07:33 AM »

thanks for the reply Ghurd, i have twentyfour of the n42 3/4 x3/4 round magnets from a failed microwave magnet project and was looking for a way to use them. could i make a six pole rotor? if i did a two pole i could stack twelve per pole in three rows, and six pole would be one row if a six pole would work. pepa.

pepa · « **Reply #7 on:** July 06, 2007, 08:12:08 AM »

thanks Stephen, for the reply, pepa.

thefinis · « **Reply #8 on:** July 06, 2007, 08:12:26 AM »

Hey Pepa sorry to hear you have been down. If you are going to use it on your biodiesel generator system then rpms may not be a problem.

Don't let the weather hurt you as I think it has been hot in your area. Heat stress is dangerous so stay cool under the ac this summer. I don't know whose weather I have been having but for west Texas it is great. Usually I have to drive to the Rocky mountains to enjoy this kind of weather and temps. Summer isn't over so it may be back to normal soon.

So many projects so little time don't stress over what isn't getting done. Train a next generation to finish the projects.

Take care

Finis

Tritium · « **Reply #9 on:** July 06, 2007, 08:24:10 AM »

thefinis, Just wondering where you are located since you made a reference to west Texas. I am south of Spur.(70 miles east of Lubbock)

Thurmond

pepa · « **Reply #10 on:** July 06, 2007, 08:34:23 AM »

thanks Finis. we have been having some 100+ days during this drout and every thing is hot, still and dusty. i was thinking that something like this could be done in the house under air conditioning. i will take it easy but i like to finish a project when i can because it stays on my mind until finished or found to not work and something else started. pepa.

ghurd · « **Reply #11 on:** July 06, 2007, 09:01:23 AM »

I don't think you have any choice but 2 pole.

("without rewiring the coils")

Advice from someone who never made a decent one?

Try to keep the magnets semi-close together. It's not easy.

I `24 hour' epoxy a few on each side. Wait a day.

Then short those to the rotor with transformer lamination layers, the kind that bends easy. (Like microwave transformers)

Next I 24 hour epoxy the next couple magnets using more lamination strips to short those to the rotor while placing them.

Repeat until out of space or magnets.

Shorting the flux to the rotor really helps with placing them.

I use those plastic bar clamps to hold things in place.

Don't epoxy the lamination strips down. :-(

Keep an eye on it for the first few hours after every epoxy secession, the stuff is like grease and they can slide very slowly for a few hours.

Don't put a lot of effort into exact magnet placement... it's like automatic de-cogging.

I never used magnets that tall. I thought about stainless steel wire zigzagged every which way through the magnets, then a health dose of more epoxy.

An example. It was a 2 pole, but 3 phase, now wired Jerry-Rigged. Works pretty good too!

http://www.otherpower.com/images/scimages/2050/3phHD.jpg

If it doesn't work, it still cheaper fun than going to a movie.

And it WILL work... at least a little!

G-

Bruce S · « **Reply #12 on:** July 06, 2007, 09:21:34 AM »

Pepa;

I was getting worried!!

I am headed back to Charleston tonight after work. Will do my best to stop by on the way back Sunday.

Bruce S

pepa · « **Reply #13 on:** July 06, 2007, 09:29:59 AM »

that would be great, be looking for you if you can make it. pepa.

pepa · « **Reply #14 on:** July 06, 2007, 09:36:27 AM »

thanks Ghurd, i'll try that. pepa

RogerAS · « **Reply #15 on:** July 06, 2007, 02:33:38 PM »

Pepa,

Sorry to hear you ain't been feelin' well. Care to tell us what's up? BTW that camera is working out great. Looking into a vid capture system for the Mac. Keep the chin up!

:-)

pepa · « **Reply #16 on:** July 06, 2007, 10:50:19 PM »

good to hear from you Roger, a while back my lungs were distroyed by cholrine Gas and i was told it was terminal within a year. so far, six years and counting. i will go out kicking and screaming, but it will be a long time from now. i am glad the camera is working for you. pepa.

RogerAS · « **Reply #17 on:** July 07, 2007, 06:27:15 AM »

Pepa,

Damn! I knew a guy in Colorado, when I lived there, that had that happen. He didn't make it past that day. Sad. Anything I can do to help you out in some way? I mean I can do a few things other than push a freakin' mouse around. :-)

Oh BTW, there was a few seconds of video of the inside of a plane cockpit left on the camera. Was that you? Do they still let you fly? There was some horses and a woman I assume was your wife.

Anyway, just keep on truckin' and count me in as one friend you've never met.

thefinis · « **Reply #18 on:** July 07, 2007, 06:43:25 AM »

I live 30 miles southeast of San Angelo, Texas. If you follow HS sports you might know of Wall, Texas

Have an Aunt that lives near Lamesa and usually go thru Lubbock when headed to Colorado. I have been to Spur but do not remember why may have been one of those scenic short cuts my wife hates.

Finis

thefinis · « **Reply #19 on:** July 07, 2007, 07:09:04 AM »

Bad stuff chlorine gas. Have breathed a little of it myself. Used to run a camp with a big swimming pool and it used chlorine gas. They have since switched to a system that uses a solid form due to safety concerns. Even breathing a little chlorine gas took days to get over. I broke all the safety rules when we had the leak no breathing gear etc but with a camp full of kids you just put their safety first and worry about consequences later.

Finis

pepa · « **Reply #20 on:** July 07, 2007, 03:12:39 PM »

Rodger, i have a feeling that we will meet one day and i do count you as a friend. for some reason i liked you and that damn rabbit from your first post. then you blew a gasket and i though you were gone but you came back stronger than ever and have been a big help to me and others. keep up the good work, maybe you can email me a couple of pictures of your place, pepa.

pepa · « **Reply #21 on:** July 07, 2007, 03:40:34 PM »

hi finis, yes it burns the little capalleries, the small vains that produce the oxigen and leaves scar tissue that cannot be repaired. i am down to 28% of my lung capasity and on oxigen 24/7. makes it agravting to keep my tubes clear when moving around, but the other choice is not even considered. another bad part is that i was fighting prostate canser when this happened and the effects of the radiation treatments overshadowed the effects of the gas and i was late getting treatment for the burnt lungs. enough crying, back to work, pepa.

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Author Topic: need help (Read 3501 times)